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Justin 0:12

Welcome to Armchair Authentic , a podcast designed to help you fulfill your God assignments through having real conversations about real life with real people .

Rhett 0:22

Justin , I'm really excited about today's episode . I mean , we're continuing a conversation that you and I began last week when you turned the tables and began to interview me about my story , and we're about to get into that . But before we do , could I just take a moment and simply say thank you so much to every single person who has taken the time to rate and review this podcast . Man , it has meant so much to us , but it has also helped us serve people in a better way . And if you have yet to follow us , could we encourage you Go to Facebook , go to Instagram . Search up Armchair Authentic . Go to Twitter , or I should say , go to X , formally known as Twitter , search Armchair Off Pod . Hit that follow button . Join the journey , join the fun . We love getting your comments , we love being able to respond to them and we're having a lot of fun with it , justin .

Justin 1:14

Yeah , and if there's a topic that you'd like us to cover on a future episode , leave that comment or email us at info at armchairauthenticcom . Well , today is going to be a powerful episode . Here's part two of our conversation with Rhett .

Finding A City To Plant A Church

Rhett 1:32

So , yeah , we were serving Tripp and Rebecca . Healy Ridge Church served them faithfully . And then , 2018 , january , they wrote us a check for $6,000 . And , by the way , that's a lot of money , but it's not enough to plan a church . We used every bit of that $6,000 to move us from Wittamka at that time all the way up to .

Justin 1:54

Boise . So now you're in Boise is what most people would know . It's a town , it's a city called Nampa , 30 minutes west , that's right . And so now you're in Nampa , talk about the process of arriving there . I think that there's future pastors listening who have they have that stirring the plant . I think there's business leaders who are thinking about starting this and there , where there's people who pray , they're praying about moving and they feel a stirring . Go through that process a little bit . You got to this new city .

Rhett 2:22

Yeah . So when I transitioned off staff of the church of Mobile and was transitioning to the church in Wittamka and the transitional period to finish out six months before we move and at this time let me back up too Like we didn't have a city , we didn't have a state , we didn't know where we were going we used some of that time to go visit cities . We went to a ton of cities in Texas . Honestly , thought we're going to end up in Austin or San Antonio . And here's a state called Idaho that I just can't get out of my mind and never been to this place . I have no like . Literally there's no art church planted , there's nobody there planting churches and I'm just looking at it and I can't . I just I look at the map , that's all I see . I pray , that's all I see . I'm like I don't know this place , I don't know this culture . It's on the other side of the map . You know , never been in the Pacific Northwest . So we go visit all the cities . We think that are the easily more doable relationships in the South , and then we take the trip up to Boise , to get off the plane and Linda can see it in my eyes . She's like oh , here we go Like you're really going to okay , you know , and it's beautiful and it's amazing , and it's summer , spring , like 70 degrees and it's not a hundred degree , like the weather could not have been more perfect . It was like God opened up the heavens and like here's the land of the promised land . That's how it felt , and we had this amazing experience of just a God moment and we realized this is where we're supposed to be . And so we come back from that trip and and although I'll let the emotions subside you know fasting , praying and then we realized , well , this is where we're called to go .

Rhett 3:55

So we begin to create a website . I begin to get clarity on vision . I begin to put places where people could give to this vision . I began to reach out to family and friends and we don't get very much money because the reality is , nobody wants to give money towards something when you're not even living there . They want to see , like , take this step . So we get through . You know , the end of 2017

Moving To Idaho

Rhett 4:20

is January 2018 . So we've got that infrastructure of the website and the vision and the community , and now it's like hey , we're now , we're moving . We got $6,000 . We probably had around 10 in the bank at that time 6,000 . That was from that check and we move . And then I'm documenting that right . So people are now seeing that step of faith and it was in that step of faith and that movement that God began to work and God began to move .

Rhett 4:45

And so the house thing was a miracle . Because in January , you know , people ask , well , how in the world did you buy a house without a job ? And the beautiful part was , I was on staff at Ridge Church and they were , they were helping . You know that that was a part of the process of allowing me to get a home . So we bought a home with equity and other money and in those kinds of things . But once we got there we did have a home . But then you know that money only lasted so long that I was getting from Ridge Church because that was a plan to let that decrease as we that was our missions giving , if you will .

Rhett 5:17

And so , yeah , I ended up having to get a job at a bakery and not like baking pies or cakes , because you don't want me doing that . I was , I was slinging bread man , like I was a bread slinger , coming off the thing hot and all that you know and the and I'm just like organizing bread and and up at like 2 30 in the morning at the place at three and there till like 11 o'clock right before lunch and then I was out doing church stuff and meeting people and trying to build community in a place where we don't know the culture , we don't know the people . One of the biggest keys that connected us to people was the relationships through arc and through grow and through Highlands , because there was a pastor in Washington that used to pastor there in the Namp area and I met him and he's like man . I've got like a ton of people that used to go to this one church and and unfortunately the church didn't exist anymore and they're looking for homes . Man and I was like connect me , connect me , connect me , and so so it was the catalyst relationship that led to catalyst families that we were able to then set up coffees and moments and we were just hearing people's story .

Rhett 6:21

Those meetings if you're a church planter and you're trying to put vision out there , just know this it had nothing to do with us . It had everything to do with the fact that we were like we're here for you , we love you and we're here to serve you . What are you passionate about ? What are you dreaming about ? Because we're here to help serve that dream , to see that come to fruition . And then it was like , wow , and we meant it and it was truthful and it comes from a pure heart . And they're like well , then , tell us what you're doing . And then we're like , oh well , we're doing this and here's our vision . And they're like I'm all in , let's go Right , because you took time to find out what's really important to other people and to say I want to support that and I want to serve that and I want to create a place where that can thrive , and not only that can thrive in your life , but that you can be used in a way to help that influence others , to see them doing the same thing .

Justin 7:08

And so January to August 2018 , you've moved to this foreign land . You are a bread slinger . You start to really build a team to prepare for launch Sunday . So now it's

Leading Up To Launch Day

Justin 7:21

September 2018 . Talk about that experience . You've done all this work . You're about to see how this unfolds , this stirring you've had in your heart for years . And here's game day .

Rhett 7:33

So we had what we would call a startup parties , which were . Now I've met people in the community one on one . Now I'm inviting them to this like event that would happen monthly . We're food and all that kind of stuff , right , and it's all faith because we don't like and then . But what's happening is , because we're moving this way and because we're showing it on social , those people that I've reached out to and sent letters to and emails to those that wanted to give you know eight months ago that we're sitting on the sidelines now that they're seeing movement and they're seeing this , they're now giving , and now these couples that are saying yes and they're all in are starting to give towards it , because we have a clear that we're like here's where we're going , this is what we're doing , this is what it looks like , it's clear , people can see it , they can run with it , and so we're doing these little launch party meetups .

Rhett 8:18

The month before we launched the church , we did where I walk people through really our simulation process . We called it . What did we call it ? I think at the end we called it discover Some churches call it their growth track and we dialed it back to what worked for us and made it our own and I had been doing growth tracks and those kind of things for years .

Rhett 8:35

Yeah , so I already knew the play , I could do it and I made it one life specific and so , yeah , so we did that with all their dream team , all their volunteers , and a part of that was finding a location , and if you're a church planner , listening location is huge . I'm grateful for where we ended up , but I want to make it very clear I did not want to start there . I wanted to be on the pretty side of town , like I wanted , like that , honestly , but we had the finances for what we had and our lot was this and so , and there was open door and so we went where there was favor . We went where we weren't tolerated but where we were celebrated .

Rhett 9:10

That's good and God really opened up a moment for us and it's so nerves Dude . People are probably saying well , I mean , you've talked about worship and all these different things and associates . How many times did you get a chance to actually preach a message ? Do you know how to preach ? And what's funny is I tell people I was like I've only preached two times before we launched the church I mean so to say , you have the faith to move your family across the country .

Rhett 9:41

You have the faith to raise money that you don't . You've never raised a dime in your life . We raised 150 , I think at the end of it was like 180 when it was all said and done . You've never preached a message . I mean , like the first message I ever preached was for the guy in Mobile who ended up not being able to get back from his vacation in time .

Rhett 10:01

And I get a call on Saturday night before a morning of three services , of a church that's running like 1500 people to preach a message . And I'm up till four in the morning , a little to no sleep , putting together a message and never done it before . But when I do it , which is cool it I mean it wasn't great , but I was like wow , there's something , there's a gift there and I know it . And so in my second time was to preach at Ridge Church and talk about what we're doing , and actually that was your two . And then my third time to preach before we launched the church was at my buddy's church in Spokane , washington , and he had no idea it was my third time . He said , dude , if you would have told me that I probably wouldn't have let you preach . I was like dude , you know . Come on , man .

Justin 10:39

Just keep that secret between us . And even the families wanting to go are probably like is there like any kind of MP3s to listen to ? Right ? Well , there were , there were there were .

Rhett 10:48

There was hey man . Can you tell me what you're like ? What do you ?

Rhett 10:50

I was like no , just wait , man , we'll get there and so , but I'll tell you this when New Year called , we knew we were and I've never done it before , but I , like you said earlier , I have . I don't give myself credit on this , but I am the kind of person if I don't know how to do something , I'm going to figure it out . And I've just learned , learned , learned . I watch well , I find the people that are doing it well , the Rick Warrens , the Chris Hodges , you know , like good Craig , rachele , all the guys that are communicating at a high level , and I study them and I watch them and I would , I would literally sit down and I would write out their entire messages on and read it , write it and read it and see how they got from A to B to C to D , looking at the way they transitioned from statement to statement . And and I was like you know , I don't know what I'm doing , so I'm just going to learn from these guys and I know God's word and I know all the stuff that I shared earlier about my story and God's faithfulness , and I know people and I and I , and so you know people aren't coming for communication , they're coming for being loved and feeling needed , feeling seen and served and not lights , not a show , not a banner , not great graphics . They're coming because of the way you make them feel and I just wanted to add value to people . I didn't get it right all the time but , you know , because that was our focus , I was just thinking I'm I'll learn the preaching side and because I've been on a platform so long communicating through worship and being comfortable with that , I was like I can learn this and that was the heart . That was . That's . The hardest part for me is because I'm not naturally , naturally gifted to create things from scratch , and so I've had to work really , really , really hard just to be okay . But yeah , so to say that I was nervous , I was scared .

Rhett 12:30

There was a lot of momentum we had , I think . I think , man , it's been a minute . I think we had 87 people on our launch team , if I remember correctly , meaning I had 87 people who have said , yes , we're all in , we're there . Game day shows up on Sunday morning 34 , there was 87 show up and you're like , okay , but looking in hindsight , that's normal , I mean , and I knew some of that was normal , but I was like , nah , that's not gonna happen to me and these are all , they're all gonna show up , right , but yeah , so we launched on September , the 16th , and again we did mailers , we did the whole , like all the startup parties , the community , the relationships , and we had momentum . We did community events and we were , people were starting to give , and so there was that momentum

Launch Day Anomaly

Rhett 13:15

. So we launched and 262 people showed up on day one and seven people made decisions for Christ .

Justin 13:22

Let me say something about that because , yeah , you were there , we , I was there and we have . We have a wide audience that has it really covers , I mean , probably 30 states right now , and so you got to understand the regional side of this . We come from Birmingham , Alabama , and it is the Bible built . Okay so .

Justin 13:43

I don't want to get on numbers so much here , but I do want to say we it's more . Even for people who aren't Christians it's built into their tradition they go to church . So when you're launching a church , at least on the launch day you still got to , you still got to have the anointing and the systems and all that to help it stand the test of time . But on that launch day you're going to have a great chance of having this turnout . That can almost you know it can be , it could be a big turnout in the South .

Justin 14:14

I do want to add just from my own personal study of the Pacific Northwest too , that was not a normal number by any stretch . That was well above . I remember a lot of the pastors in the community were shocked that you had a launch like that . So I just want to understand the different audience who are listening . Pacific Northwest is not going to have as many because it's not built into the culture as much .

Justin 14:40

This was a . I was there on that day . I flew out . I got to be an overseer with One Life Church for the season that you were there and it was from your best friend watching it . It was just surreal for me to be standing in the back just watching these people come in , because I remember being at backstage as you were kind of prepping the team and praying through before they go out and get in position . We're kind of peeking out just curious of is anybody going to come ? Yeah , and it was so amazing to me watching that room and people come in and then the band starts and then you're leading , but then to have you come around .

Justin 15:21

It reminded me of the first month of Church of the Highlands when I saw Pastor Chris doing the same thing leading , but then he would step aside and began preaching , and so it was amazing to me the favor that was on that church launch and it wasn't you , obviously , but it was you in the sense of being the vessel , but you also assembled this great team around you and that was a really cool day . So what's going through your mind now that the dream of planting a church just happened ?

Rhett 15:52

Yeah , Well , the night before we planted I couldn't sleep . You were at the house and we stayed up to like one in the morning , like putting together maybe three . I remember , and when I got in bed , finally , I was just freaking out . My heart was racing . I was just . I'm a nervous individual by nature . I'm growing through that , but like I'm just nervous in the fact of I just get anxiety really .

Justin 16:15

Is . Tom Hanks said and you got Mel that you make coffee nervous .

Rhett 16:22

I can and so . But all that , especially when there's when I have a high responsibility , you know , and when the level and the playing field tie right . And so I was like I didn't know if anybody was going to come . I mean , I knew the people that had been part were going to come , but yeah , it was . That was an amazing moment and I don't want to fast forward through that .

Rhett 16:43

You're right , you know , coming from the South , planting a church in the Northwest in a culture that really is D churched , very religious in that the LDS Latter-day Saints community , you know , has a very stronghold religious spirit in that area of the country . And you're in an area of the country where everybody's like , man , I got the mountains , I got this , I got that . I don't really need anything Like why would I need church ? Right , and so what a miracle . All glory , all honor , all praise to God .

Rhett 17:14

I'm just some little Alabama boy with a Southern Hexland that loves Jesus and I just want to know that , like that's , please know , it's not because I'm great , it's just because he's faithful , and so that was one of those mountaintop moments ,

Routines Without Rest

Rhett 17:29

yeah , and so go to bed . I'm on that high , I'm like this is amazing . And then you know , monday hits and you're like , wow , we get to do this , like it took us what ? Like how many years ? And really , just if we looked at January , for when we moved to there , what is that ? Nine months to get to that one moment . And now we got to turn around , do it again in seven days or six days .

Rhett 17:48

Right , and then I was like okay , and then that was . And you're like that honeymoon phase of writing this high and you have so much energy and you don't realize the um , the adrenaline rush that it is and in the capacity , and other people are telling you you know you're going to need to do some of these things , you're not going to be able to sustain that and you're like , yeah , yeah , yeah , yeah , whatever , you know , you hear it , and you're just like one of you are out , the other , I can do this . You know Superman and um , yeah , that just became a game , not a game , but like a . And how do I figure out the rhythms in my life to be able to sustain this ? And I , I felt at that .

Justin 18:24

Talk about that .

Rhett 18:25

Well , I mean , I felt at that in in you know , we always say God has not called us to put our family , to sacrifice our family at the altar of ministry , and I know that and I believe that , however , the fruit of that , like I would say , I'm not doing that , but yet , looking back now through the lens , I was doing that in some , some ways , meaning every waking moment was church , church , this , that , this , that every conversation . I couldn't sit down and have a conversation with my wife and in it not be about church . Now , understand that we are the church and I understand that we are right , but like it was like there was no way to like really turn off my mind just to focus on anything other than what's coming tomorrow in this meeting and that meeting and what needs to happen and we're going to get these finding . Are we going to be able to pay the rent on this and just all the stuff as a you know you're not a business owner .

Rhett 19:18

You're , you're called to lead a church , but there are so many aspects of business that that go into it , whether right or wrong , it's just is . And you've got to have money to pay the rent for the facility and the lights and electricity and to be able to , like , do ministry and so um . So yeah , I just I just kind of dived into this season of not really resting well and because I didn't rest well , I I wasn't leading the best that I could lead . Now , I'm not saying I was a horrible leader , but looking back , I wish I would have taken more time to rest in meaning having a day like , according to scripture , god rested on the seventh day just creating those . I knew I should be doing it and I would tell myself I'm doing it . I just I didn't know how to do it .

Rhett 20:03

And I got to where , if you were to ask me , hey man , what do you do for fun ? I'd be like well , it's church and like , well , that's not good man , it's not that church can't be fun , but it's not a healthy place to be . Yeah , so if I ask you as a pastor not you , but as a church planter , when I asked these young guys . I'm like , hey man , what are you doing for fun , what are your hobbies or what do you do when you're not doing this ? They're like , uh , I think for the fact that I can't answer that question , that's probably not good and I'd go yeah , it's not good , I was there too Like you're not healthy , you're actually sick , and so yeah , and but yeah , you're seeing the fruit of everything that God's doing .

Lance 20:40

Right .

Rhett 20:41

And and your family loves you . But , like Saturdays , for me they always ended up being message prep and they shouldn't have been . I should have been able to dial that in earlier in the week and but you know , I I wasn't good at being able to manage my time in ways to where I could accomplish everything that need to be accomplished for the church in addition to message and to worship , Cause I was wearing every hat at first in the church was growing and the teams were growing and , don't get me wrong , Dream teams were growing . We had people .

Rhett 21:10

But you know , when you're starting from scratch and these people don't understand the culture and the vision of where you're going or where you're headed , and some of their gifts sets aren't to the place yet to where you can really give them things to run with it , Um , yeah , I was having to carry a lot for a long time and it and eventually kind of called up to me yeah , because you were building , you were constructing a culture there that it might be taken for granted in certain places around the country , but you're in a place , literally a wilderness , a desert .

Justin 21:39

Yeah , uh , creating a culture , and obviously you know God brought you some people to um , help , uh , go on this path with you , but you still have that sense of if , if you want something done . Right , you got to do it yourself Right .

Justin 21:55

And so you know you're taking all this own . And so for one

Sprinting In A Marathon

Justin 21:59

to two years into the church , I imagine all this is going through your mind . You're going through euphoria of wow , I can't believe people are coming back . We were experiencing lives changed , which was happening all the time . You know in another way , disbelief that this is a community that did not exist and now it does . Right . So you're going in this up and down spectrum of emotions of this is amazing . Oh , my goodness , I'm running ragged to get these amazing results , but I'm suffering over here . Is that what I'm hearing ? You say yeah .

Rhett 22:29

I mean eventually . I mean I don't want to say that every moment was just like , like it was . There were a lot of great moments , even in the fast pace , but I was running a sprint . You can't run a sprint in a marathon , right , right . And so this is a marathon race and everything that we do longevity , and I was running at a sprint pace and I never learned how to really dial it back until I had to dial it back while we launched with 262 , which was amazing by December we I think it was like 87 .

Rhett 23:01

And then and then it was a slow roll from there . One of the last Easter's before we left , we were grateful we were right around that 400 mark with people coming on Easter and for me that was like this is amazing , it's awesome . Why am I ?

Justin 23:14

miserable . What's the moment that you ? You gave the attention to it , where you knew this isn't just a passing thought .

Rhett 23:21

Yeah , well , I think there were many times in many signs from my incredible wife who were like hey , you need to slow down , right ? Do you enjoy this ? Ask me a lot , are you loving what you get to do ?

Lance 23:35

I'm like yeah , I love what I get to do .

Rhett 23:37

She's like well , you don't seem like you love me . She's just being very kind to very , very , just , very gentle and I was like , yeah , of course I mean . Yeah , it was just like why are you so like ? If you do and I'm not saying you don't , but why are you so critical of everything ? It's never enough , it's never good enough , it can always be better .

Rhett 23:56

And there's never a man and not say like you need to grow to a place where you arrive , but you at least need to be able to enjoy the journey and the process and the moments that are right in front of you of what God is doing now Not what you're hoping he does tomorrow , but really enjoy it today . And so those were a lot of moments and I would say there were moments where I would feel like I'm doing good , and then it would just get back right in the same routine and I would say it came down to the point in man , what was it ? 20 , 21 . Yeah , yeah . So I tell people that 2020 caught up to me in 2021 , because not only did we launch a church by faith and see the miracle that happened , 2019 was our growth year , right , and trying to grow .

Rhett 24:39

And then

Navigating Pandemics and Fast Pace Culture

Rhett 24:40

2020 hits and we're all like everybody's going out of their minds . Everybody becomes an expert of how to navigate a global pandemic . They're all professionals within one week . And I'm like I mean all the people are all the podcasters . All the people are like you need this and this one ain't happening . I'm like y'all don't know . Y'all don't know nothing . Y'all know nothing .

Rhett 25:02

Stop acting like you know how to lead through a pandemic you haven't ever lived through . None of us have lived through a pandemic so that , and just being bombarded by professionals and you should do this , you should do that . And then you got the politiculeness and you got the height of all this and no matter what you did as a pastor , it was , it wasn't going to be right . You were not set . You were set up to fail based off of what culture and everything was happening and you should shut down . You shouldn't shut down . You don't love people if you don't wear a mask , or you do wear a mask and like what do you do ? And and you know , it was just like oh , my God , help me , lord , it's hard to believe that we lived that , that that was a reality , man , it was a crazy time and then knowing that you're growing something is like , oh man , are we going to get through this ?

Rhett 25:41

Is this it ? Are we going to hit , I mean , people still going to get like , how is this ? All the questions . And so obviously we move through that . But all those stresses and things and talk about fast-pacedness , even though we were condensed to being at home , stuff still had to happen . We were still doing ministry , we're still trying to get food out to people and toilet paper to people , all that stuff , right , I mean , and just the stress of life and everything , and then trying to create video to a place , to where it's at an excellent quality , all that in any way . So January excuse me , June , ish of 2021 is when I feel like 2020 finally caught up to me . But it was really . It really wasn't . It was a year . It was years of of living in fast-paced culture .

Rhett 26:22

It just wasn't church planting , that caught up to me , it was how I was living my life , going back all the way to North Star , you know , north Star to Highlands , to this , to that , you know , and in just this whole idea of just , I'm a doer , I get things done and I get a doer and you get things done . I love God , and we're going to love God and get things done and do things . And I just found my place at a kind of like a . I forget there was a reference in a book that I read . It was talking about sinkholes in Florida , and nobody knows that . You know , the ground looks fine , but then , all of a sudden , over time , all of a sudden , the ground just gives way and there's a massive sinkhole . People are like what just happened ? Well , what happened is there was a hole developing underneath that foundation , underneath the foundation , and on the surface , everything looks great . But because that water is just eroding the ground underneath , it's becoming empty . And because it's becoming empty , all of a sudden , now what's on the foundation ? Right , it just it , it just collapses . It's the best way that I can say it .

Rhett 27:19

And so what was happening in me was I would love God , and I do and I'm passionate about the Lord , but , like what was happening in my soul , I wasn't pouring into my soul the way that I should have in order to sustain what was happening outwardly . And so , june of 2021

A Time To Plant

Rhett 27:35

, it was just like my wife is like I'm out . I'm like what do you mean ? You're out . And she's like , yeah , I quit the church . And if you're listening to this , uh , you know , in your hearing this , you're probably like for those who are part of this journey , you're probably like what ? I didn't know that , yeah , but she was like I don't , like I love you , I'm not leaving you , like I'm , I'm all in , I'm all in for you and our family and all of that . But like you're not happy and and you need to figure out what it is . And I was like are you kidding me ? And she's like I'm really serious , like I'm going to go back to Birmingham and let you figure it out .

Rhett 28:11

And so it was that awakening moment to where I was like , okay , God's doing some great things . I love God . There's not a sin issue . It's just a matter of trying to prioritize my life in a way that is sustainable for my family first , my love for God , my family and the church . Yeah , god causes all things to grow . This is his baby , not mine . Not all that responsibilities on his shoulders , not mine . I'm carrying way too much . God never called me to carry that much .

Rhett 28:37

Yeah , and it was also in that season where I was like , okay , I need to focus on me . I'm so caught up in focusing on everybody else I forgot about me . And because I've forgotten about me , it's affecting my family . It's now , it's affecting these things . And so I began to take a deep dive , started going to counseling which , by the way , I used to look at counseling as one of these things were only really , really sick people who were like they need some serious help , man Right .

Rhett 29:03

And then I come to realize , wait a minute , I wish I would have started a counseling journey like back when I was 15 , 14 , 13 , because , oh my goodness , so true , so true , having somebody to help you navigate the traumas of life that have put you into making certain decisions . So I began to get healthy and get into a place again , not a sin issue , just a healthy finding out not who I am , but like the rhythms of life and getting sustainability in my soul and health and family , and so on and so forth . And through that journey getting into a healthy place , I'm still leading and I'm starting to leave , and better than I ever have , and I'm starting to create boundaries . How about that word ? Yeah , boundaries , it's a good one , and I didn't know what a boundary was because I led in a way that we don't have any boundaries . We're pastors . Everybody has 100% , complete access into our life at any time , at any point , at any place , and if they ask something that needs to be done , I'm in their life , I'm in their place , I'm there , and that is not healthy at all and , of course , I would run ragged if that's . I don't have any boundaries . So I learned how to create boundaries .

Rhett 30:07

And when we began to create boundaries in our life and began to get healthy with us and sustained rhythms and rest and get back to a place where we really enjoy what we're doing and , by the way , my wife my wife didn't quit the church . She didn't like it , like , but I got healthy and in that place of getting healthy again , it was one of those to where I began to think clearly and I began to realize how God created me , in the gift set that he's given me , and began to see clearly that , you know , we began to ask ourselves questions , started to dream again and all these different things . And it was in those moments , you know , a year after that 2021 , going into 2022 , to where God made it very clear to us that , rhett , while I have gifted you and I've called you to plant this church and I've been faithful in that a part of the journey in your life is I'm calling you to plant , right , but I'm not necessarily calling you to stay . And he says you remember Paul in the Bible ? I was like , yeah , I mean , I read what .

Rhett 31:09

Two thirds of the New Testament is Paul . So I'm reading the . He's like what did Paul stay in one place ? I was like , no , he's like I'm not calling you to stay in one place . I've called you to plant , to pass . I've called you to plant to raise up a team and leaders and to pass the baton . And and here's the here's where I had an issue with that at first is because I found myself realizing that some people are called to plant , to create a foundation and a structure , to pass .

Rhett 31:41

Everybody's called to plant and to stay for 30 , 40 years . Right , some people are , but I began to recognize no wonder I'm frustrated .

Justin 31:49

That's good .

Rhett 31:50

No wonder I'm getting so like because I realized really quick that , wait a minute , God's assignment on my life was to plant this church 100% , but it was never to stay here forever . That freed me , it set me free and I was like unbelievable , Like how did I miss this ? And I know why I missed it . Because there's a misunderstanding or there's miscommunication and in , in , in and from great leaders who will say when you go somewhere , you got to go there to die . Yeah , Go ahead and pick out your burial plot , baby , let's go Now . That's an old school way of thinking and there's nothing wrong with that and I I understand the concept of where they're coming from . When people say that , what they're saying is you need to be willing to let go of everything and to go , be there and go on in .

Lance 32:31

Rhett 32:31

Okay , because if you're not willing to go all in , you shouldn't go anyway . That's right . That's really what they're trying to say , and I would say why don't you say it that way ? So , um , because

The Five Fold Ministry

Rhett 32:42

some people are called to plant , some are apostles , some are pastors , some are teachers , some are evangelists and some are prophets , and none of them are greater than the other . They all have their role and they're all important . When I began to do a study of myself and take a deep dive into my giftings outside of a standard disc , I began to realize that my giftings of apostleship now in the world they call that entrepreneurship he who has a vision and has the ability to care that vision , to empower people , to inspire people , to get them to create something that never existed and to move forward , to build that foundation and to keep going Right . For me , that was that's high gifting .

Rhett 33:23

Um , pastor , teacher , I have those giftings . They're a lot lower prophecy too . Um , and what I realized is that I'm not called to be the five fold ministry . If you're a church planter or you're a pastor listening , I hope you hear this you are not called to be the five fold ministry . And three to four years , then I'm still doing the five fold ministry . No wonder I'm exhausted , because you can only operate in your strength for so long , or even in your lesser strengths . You can't like , you need others .

Rhett 33:55

And so , for me , I just began to realize I'm called to plant . In fact , what fires me up is in , in in . You told me about being authentic , right . You know , my wife and I have this ongoing conversation , but I'm like I could plant again . I'm not not right now , but like I know I could go do that again , because not that I have the skill set for it , but I have the gift set for it , and that fires me up to think about that . Maybe one day we will , maybe we won't , I don't know , but I know that that is a high gifting , right . And how I distribute that gift and steward that gift in my life , um , may look different , but you know , the idea of even partnering with churches that plant and help them , and even passing the baton to other pastors . That fires me up . I love that .

Rhett 34:36

And so I began to self-discovery in this process . For me , it's my journey , my story . Nobody not everybody's called to do this , but for me that was a big getting healthy , getting into a place , self-discovery , realizing my gifts . And I got to a place where I realized God called me to plant the church , but he didn't call me to pasture this church for forever . And so I met with you , the overseers , we met with other people and and got a lot of godly wisdom , prayed 21 days , prayer and fasting , and and , long story short , it was very clear . It was very evident we were to pass the baton .

Rhett 35:09

We took that step which , by the way , was very difficult , was not easy . We did not quit anything . We followed the voice of God in every moment . And , um , it was hard . It was difficult to be able to to walk away from your baby , your child , if you will I know it wasn't , but just saying that , your dream in everything that you've put your identity into and all these things , like all the stuff that you have to work through , that was hard , very difficult and we can have conversations about that at another time , but I'll tell you this the pastors that we found and that Lord gave us it was beautiful . Um , you were a huge part of that transition . I feel like we did the very best that we knew how to do to transition to church . We stayed probably a lot longer than you should probably , but like it was just a beautiful thing and the church never decreased .

Rhett 35:57

It's going on , it's growing , it's flourishing . Now it's a great leadership Shout out to pastor Jason and Ellie Hubbard and the team that's moving it forward . And , uh , it's cool . Now I'm on the founding end , looking at what God did and is continuing to do because of our faithfulness . There's no greater joy than that , I'm telling you . And now I'm getting to do some things that are different , that aren't any greater or any lesser , but they're just different and they are hopefully going to continue to make an impact . And , um , and who knows , maybe one day we'll plan another church . I don't know . I don't know , but I'm just going to be trusting the Lord with all your heart and not on your own understanding , and all your ways , ignalize him , submit your ways to him and he will direct your path and make your path straight , and that's , that's my life verse and that's what we're continuing to move forward on man .

A Time To Pass

Justin 36:43

So well . One of the things that you said that we should give ear to is the sobering conversations or the sobering incidents that can happen , that are awakening moments for us and in your case , in many of our cases , that's the beauty of our spouses . When your wife had that , you know obviously she loves the local church but , she was making a point by saying hey , I quit the church and I know you cleared this up , but she's not quitting the church of Jesus .

Justin 37:07

Christ she was it was the mentality of this is armchair authentic and you had been read this authentic person husband , leader , friend and she had seen this authenticity leave and she saw this plastic person , if you will , because you were trying to do everything . And it reminds me of the time . There's a great author named Pete Schizzaro that you and I love yeah . And and just awesome books . Emotionally healthy spirituality , emotionally healthy leader . Great books I recommend .

Rhett 37:37

I read that book and that season is great it really is .

Justin 37:39

And he had the same moment where his wife came and said the same thing , and it was . It was the same , you know lesson to learn . It was a wake up call to him , and so the takeaway for those who are listening is pay attention to those moments and be humble . To listen to the people that God has given you , or even not just the people , but our bodies give us great indicators on what we're going through and the way that you responded in that season . Obviously you took the path of humility . You listened to it .

Justin 38:09

I think , there are those of us who keep going and if we operate in pride which was the original sin , right , and when you don't humble yourself , you keep going because you don't think that there are parameters , you think you're invincible and that's why you will see it lead to such a burnout that you end up seeing these disqualifying factors or people are just burnout and they never want to lead again and they're really short changing theirself .

Justin 38:33

But the way you said it , they're trying to operate in the five offices , Yep , instead of trying to lock in what their God gift , their God assignment truly is and then building up those people . And so here we are . That led to the whole story you just shared about the beautiful transition which I got to be a part of and it was beautiful and if anybody is ever in that situation , rep is a great one to talk through , talk to . So you just email us on that one info at armchairauthenticcom and ask that question because wanting to watch that process happen the way you submitted yourself , when the control side of you probably wants to kick in and say here's how it ?

Justin 39:14

is . You've made the decision . The founding pastors have stepped in . You've tried to equip them with as much as they need to keep the systems running the way they were , and now you're stepping out . You're getting your house ready , your family , they go ahead and you want to get them in school , get them secure . You've got them back home taken care of . Yeah , Talk about that process .

Rhett 39:35

And then there was the faith which was stepping into faith and launching a church and then stepping into faith , walking away , if you will , from from that towards what God has next , but not knowing what's next , but knowing that God's called you into a place of not knowing what's next , which , in our minds , makes no sense , which is trust God . Don't lean on your own understanding . When you've come into a relationship with God and you've walked with them for as long as I have , and have grown to read his word and see how he speaks and communicates , you begin to see and you begin to rest securely in the fact , when he speaks , something that doesn't quite always make sense , you realize I don't have to see the full picture . I know that my father has my best interest in mind , and not only mine , my families and those he's calling me to , that I don't even know where I'm headed , and so God was calling us into that season and some people are like , well , how's your threat ? Like , do you have another job opportunity coming open ? Like , where are you going ? I'm like , no , they're like no way . Like no , well , where are you going ? Well , the only thing that makes sense is to go back the way we came , which was to go back to Birmingham , which is where all our family is now , and to go back to that . That's all we know . We don't know what's next . I have no clue , in which some people they can't process , they just it's like I , that does not compute . I can't put A , b , c , that just um . You know , and and I've just learned that this journey that I'm on with the Lord is always leading me into places to where I don't know . But I know we're called here , so we're going to go , and God will always show up , and he has and he did in the form of twin falls of believers church and my buddy , fascia clay Ramirez and fascia Heather Ramirez , in the beautiful people that call will leave your church home . Any house so has , with church of the highlands and with Highlands college and with with the 501 C three that we're now creating .

Rhett 41:31

That came from a place of pain and need in my own life as a church planner , now that I'm able to , in turn , invest in other church planters so that they're not walking that road alone , so that they do have um , when , when they need to get a break , they can get that break and that relief , and not just so they get a Sunday off , but that they can create some healthy systems of rest in their life , and that I can't come alongside them and say , hey , I know exactly where you are and this is what I've learned . I would encourage you to do this and that and the other . So , yeah , and what I would say if I , before I close the chapter on on on one life moving forward , I would say that , man , there were so many beautiful moments . Over 400 people gave to made decisions for Jesus . You know , I think , if , if , anything that's that's eternal , like that , that's amazing .

Rhett 42:16

The people , the families . And the one of my greatest joys and it will always be is on a Sunday morning , standing on the back wall looking out and seeing all the community and all the families and all the relationships that now exist . Only because we took a step Now , god could have still and he would have cause he loves his kids that much to create those opportunities . But because my wife and I and my son stepped out and created a space and a place and a community , people came together and their relationships that will last a lifetime .

Rhett 42:46

Now , because of that , and that's just to me , that is , if you ask me my greatest joy ? It's the salvation , but it's the families , because I didn't grow up with that right Probably goes back to my childhood . But to know that I was a part of connecting people in a way that I didn't have to be in their world , like I didn't have to be a part and deeply rooted in their you know , one-on-one conversations . But because I , those conversations were happening and I was just a part of that , like I don't know man , that just brings a tear to my eye and a smile to my face and that's the greatest joy . And so my church planting journey . It was really all about creating family for people who didn't have a family . So good .

Rhett 43:26

And so that is to me what church planting is all about . So that was the greatest joy in it . It will always have a very special place in my heart and and I love one life , church with all my heart and never would have dreamed that God would call me out . But he has no-transcript . Through taking the step out , I told people it was like this . It was like you remember the old Polaroid cameras .

Justin 43:49

Yeah .

Rhett 43:49

I'm dating myself , but I know they kind of came back in popularity a few years ago . They did when you like , you know you click it . All right , you take a picture , you click it , but you can't see the photo . But the photo gets , comes out , right , and then you have to flap it in the air , right , you're blowing on it , it's like white and you're like I don't know . I know there's a picture coming .

Rhett 44:10

Wait a minute , it might take an hour but , it's coming and it's like it will develop slowly . Like I felt like God . The picture that God gave us was go back the way you came , um , pass the baton and know that I'm with you . Go back home . We did . And then , slowly but surely , as we took those steps , uh , my buddy , pastor Clay Ramirez he out always had a dream . We'd always talked and kidded around like , hey , what would it look like ? We got together and even merged our church or whatever , all that kind of stuff .

Rhett 44:40

And , um , I was like , nah , probably not going to happen . And yet , and yet , when I found myself in transition , my house wasn't selling in because everything the market did what it did in 2022 when , uh , interest rates went through the roof from like 2.9 to now like 9% or whatever they went up to , and I think I don't know where they are right now but and so my house wasn't selling and it was a brand new house , so it should have sold , especially in the market . That's one of the hottest housing markets on the planet , so everything was settling and because of that , there was a delay .

A Delay Brings New Opportunity

Rhett 45:13

And here's the thing what seems to be a delay doesn't mean a denial , and my factor is thinking well , god . I miss God , but know what happened wasn't God's sovereignty . He caused my house not to sell , to create an opportunity where I would go to twin falls while I'm living in Idaho and I drive over over every weekend . Just build relationship , build relationship and that relationship turned into man . We can do this together and we started doing things together .

Rhett 45:33

I was preaching for him , teaching and helping him . You know , with everything that I've learned , helping teach . You know , not that I know everything , but just the things that I've learned , helping implement those and making things better . And and and I love the joy of getting to serve another pastor because I was like God , what I would have given to have had somebody like me serve me this way ? Right , and I'm like I want to serve you and help you and I know God will bless me for it .

Justin 45:55

And and it's something you've always done .

Lance 45:59

Justin 45:59

You've always been about serving somebody else's dreams .

Rhett 46:02

And so , by serving his dream and a season of transition for me , not knowing what's next , my house eventually sold , and but when it sold , he and I were both like we , you know , we got to continue this . This is like something that's really working and very healthy . It's healthy for him , healthy for me , healthy for the church , and and so we just kind of creatively got together on what it would look like , and so once a month I'm spend a week up there . I don't necessarily like being gone a week from my family , but the beautiful part is that I'm able to get a lot accomplished and it also allows me to create the missions , work of relief pastors , of what we're doing right now for other church planters , and yeah , so that's kind of how that was created . And then you and I have always dreamed about doing something together and we're we're stewarding something with this , what is kind of a hobby which who knows what God will do with it , but the funny thing with that hobby and play it always has purpose with it .

Justin 46:55

Every bit of it does .

Rhett 46:57

Yeah , and in worship I mean what I don't know , we'll see . And so here I am in Alabama getting to work for a church in Idaho , but I'll create a missions organization for pastors that offer relief and it's the coolest thing , man .

Justin 47:09

So and and just with this being the podcast it is , and you get to go on this journey , as we've invited you guys . Come on this journey with us , right , and so you'll literally be going on this journey as you're really beginning to launch this , and so , even in different episodes , we're going to be hearing a lot more about what is this relief pastors , and clearly , everything that you've been through . As we started this interview , we talked about the beauty that comes from the ashes and you've had to get vulnerable to really set up the things and the hurts and the wounds and the let downs that you've gone through , where I know you'll say you'll take a step forward , two steps back , but obviously , when God's carrying you , that step forward goes a lot further .

Justin 47:53

So you still yeah making progress , so much progress in your life . And God has created the beauty where he gives you this .

A Beautiful Burden For Pastors

Justin 48:01

It's this beautiful burden that God will give all of us when it's our assignment . And you see things in pastors that most people won't see . You see the hurt , you see the loneliness or isolation that they're probably going through because you've been there and you understand it . And God allowed you to walk this journey so that you can be that big brother , that father figure , that pastoral care , that help to these pastors , who they might be , in that sense where it's not apostolic and they're not leaving in three to four years or five years . They may be there for the 30 or 40 years like you talked about .

Justin 48:39

You're wanting to make sure that they have that hand holding their hand , so that better , or two , so that if one falls into a pit , you want to be that person who pulls them out of that pit , because you know the fall will come , you know the frustrating times coming , but you have this special beautiful burden to give time to these people and to help them thrive . And when we say thrive , we're in this mindset like it's all about riches and just everything's just so great . But when we say thrive , we mean wonder it's that ? Wonder it's the whole mindset that , no matter the circumstance , through rich or poor , through sickness and health , just like you would have this wedding vow , you are committed completely to stay the course and live with the fact of Jesus is the aim of why we do all this and pointing people to him so that he receives glory is why we do all this and you're taking your time and have this burden to help people in ministry who are on this what can be a very lonely road .

Rhett 49:43

Yeah , it's thriving in your soul , as the house built on the rock , not on the sand . When the wind and the rain and the waves or whatever comes pounding , whatever circumstances , is that you're thriving because you're founded on the rock . That's it , man . That's thriving .

Justin 50:01

I've shared this with you as an encouragement . I know you know this , but I want people to hear this . When

Prioritizing Family

Justin 50:07

you talk about your primary ministry as your family , I look at a situation maybe you guys are out there and you're in this situation and it feels like you're stepping out of something that would be labeled as awesome and taking on something a little more obscure . But what I've noticed over the past year year and a half you have been the primary pastor and minister to your family and you have allowed your family to really kind of come into this moment of stability . And , even though it was still a faith step , your wife is thriving in life . Not only that , there's many people who are the beneficiaries of her grace gift of , even with Highlands College , but she's bringing to make that even another level of where we're wanting to go . Your son is plugged in and excelling in so many things and getting to jump in and discover new passions .

Justin 51:02

And they're able to do that because dad , who's used to running seven days a week , because that performer in you wants to please right , You've learned to break free of that and say that does not define me , it doesn't mean I'm not going to do that either , but you've learned how to compartmentalize it in the right priority and now your family is thriving and actually being pastor the best , when you're the most obscure thing you feel like you've probably ever been .

Rhett 51:27

And my identity was tied into what I did outwardly , and it doesn't make me a bad person , it makes me human . You know . To to , to to , because one of my love languages is affirmation , and so I'm the kind of guy that loves to give affirmation so that I'll get affirmation , and I don't do that like site , like thinking about it , but I love to affirm people because I like to be affirmed . You always give out of the language that you like . I think we talked about that a few weeks ago . And so walking into a season of obscurity to where you know nobody knows your name , if you will , it is contradictory to culture . Yeah , culture says no , do all these things so you can be seen and be heard and make a difference and you can have identity and purpose . And God says my purpose comes from me , like , and I've gone through a season this past year to where I've just shut every the best that I can . I mean like just shut down , turn things off , and I'm still doing . But you're not seeing it outwardly , but I appreciate what you're saying because it is so true . That's exactly what I've been focused on this year .

Rhett 52:36

My legacy isn't what I do , my legacy is my family . My legacy is my wife , my legacy is my son in them , loving God and serving the Lord and loving other people . It comes down to loving God and loving people . That's it . It doesn't come down to building buildings or having a lot of butts and seats or whatever hand raises , no , like , no . I'm not saying all that's not important , it does play . I have a part to play , but the most important thing that we are called to , if you are a husband and a father husband to your wife first , then father to your kids and that is the most important and I can't honestly say I wish I could .

Rhett 53:14

I'm not proud of this . I'm not saying I've been a bad dad or a bad leader in the house no , because they're amazing . But like I have become better , I've gotten better . I've tried to focus more on just being a dad and in the moment , in listening . You know , and I'm still growing . But if anything that has come out of this , like this past year and I hope that I can and not hope I will , lord willing , continue to push forward on this is to enjoy the moment that is in front of you , because you're not promised the next , but just to really soak that in and to be there and so , out of my place of rest in my soul , I'm able to be now available and lead well in my family and in all the other areas . I wish I could have said I was doing that great and I'm just . You know , you get better , you grow , you learn .

When Doing Comes From Your Being

Rhett 54:06

The fact is we're followers of Christ .

Justin 54:10

We don't ever arrive at a point and we live , though , like we're arriving , and so what it does is it creates this what ends up being a conflict , because you're living where your being comes from your doing I've heard it said before and what you've done , red is upside down kingdom . It's not about being on top . It's about serving from the bottom and serving up . And you've turned it upside down and now your doing comes from your being .

Justin 54:39

Yeah that's so good and in this obscurity and just locking in to please the Lord with what he is giving you to steward with your family and these other things , with the church and twin falls and all these things . But you've just been being and what I've been able to see and it really resonates with me because I feel like this has been our story and it's the peeling of the onion that we go through is as we're being formed more and more as followers of Christ . You're accomplishing more right now by not trying to . Then , the days that you were running , running the sprint , trying to accomplish a marathon , you never were going to do it and it can happen to everybody who is listening , because it is such an act of expression , because expression first , it's not movement . The first part of real , true expression is surrender so good and then through that humility that happens . The second part of expression is ambition , but it's worthy ambition . So now you're able to see through what do I need to be doing and what do I not need to be doing .

Justin 55:50

What defines me and I'm doing actions there . Well , now you can actually turn it upside down and realize I'm not gonna do that just because I feel like that brings me value . This is my worthy ambition . You're reaching heights that you couldn't have had you tried .

Rhett 56:06

My legacy is not what I do , it's my family . Yeah , that doesn't mean I don't . I mean , of course , who's doing ? You serve your family , you love your . But I'm just saying it's not a what I do outside of my family .

Rhett 56:17

Yeah it's not a what I do on a platform . It's not what I do , you know , in a green room or in a worship setting or whatever like , or what people think or what you know . No , no , no . My legacy is knowing that the people who are closest to me that know me the most love me my family , specifically that I'm their hero . I want to be their hero .

Rhett 56:34

Yeah in the story . I want them to . Man , my dad told me love me every day , he's proud of me and he spoke into me and he helped me . And you know my husband loved me and , yeah , you know and serve me and love me , like Jesus loved the church and no , he wasn't perfect , but , man , he was a man on his face , you know , before the Lord and in those things , because at the end of the day , when it's all said and done , people don't remember you for what you did . They remember you really truly for who you were , and I really want to be remembered for who I am , not what I do , and it starts in the home .

Rhett 57:07

I'm

A Network Of Friendship

Rhett 57:08

grateful and I think it's very important to understand that not only did I have a wife who is supporting me and my son who loves me , but I also had a network of friendship with you and was a close buddy who could walk with me , and I had godly men and women as well . You know they're married to their husbands and so forth speaking into my life and being receptive to listening and growing through those things . So I've never been alone through this , which is great , and I've even though Motionally I might have felt alone . I knew I wasn't alone in that , no matter what I was going through through any season of life . The community aspect , or what we would say in church or small group aspect of having somebody close enough to you that really knows the real you , what you're going through , that is a huge secret sauce . Yeah to Having been able to see beauty from ashes .

Wrap Up and Excerpt From Lance Ingram

Justin 58:00

Well , what a powerful episode and what a great line to end it with that God will make beauty for ashes . Well , we're excited about next week we have a conversation with Lance Ingram from Warrior United . Here's an excerpt from our conversation with Lance .

Lance 58:23

There's just nothing easy about it . Yes , the spirit when he's leading , there's going to be an Affirmation from him that you are right where you need to be . But every obstacle in the natural is gonna come and try to derail you from the next step that God wants you to take . Now . I'm telling you right now if you step up and you take that next step , there is going to be some type of resistance , some type of obstacle , some type of opposition that is going to come your way to prevent you from doing that , because that is the entire Purpose of being on this earth is completing that assignment .

Contact Us: Info@ArmchairAuthentic.com

Rhett 58:58

Thank you for joining us on another episode of armchair authentic , a podcast with Rhett and Justin . Please email us at info@ armchair authentic . com .