Justin: 0:00

Some of the greatest moments, as we've said, which has been a theme of our podcast, the ordinary stuff that you're in right now that is leading to the very thing that you probably are feeling that God tugging your heart. It happens through this organic, very maybe even obscure path that you're walking of faithfulness, of planting, of watering, of cultivating and to actually see harvest grow. You've now walked the quiet path. You've walked the long, faithful years that have built your character to actually help you maintain and stay rooted as you've gotten taller, to actually be secure in what you're doing.

Rhett: 0:42

I think a lot of people would rather skip the process of persevering in obscurity and just jump to the flash in the pan platform moment as fast as I can and be seen, even if that means that it's short-lived. What is going on, friends? Welcome back to another episode of the podcast with your friends Rhett and Justin right here at Armchair Authentic it's always great to have you along for the ride today. We cannot wait to jump into the conversation.

Justin: 1:31

So we're jumping into it right now. You guys ready, here we go. So we're a week into April now, and most people have probably finished up all their spring breaking. I would think, wouldn't you?

Rhett: 1:39

Oh yeah, I would think so, but today is April Fool's Day, do we want to talk about that. I mean, I know it's not for those who are listening but it was last week yeah, so I'm not. I don't know if I should believe anything that's coming out of your mouth right now.

Justin: 1:53

Yeah, we yeah, no april fool's jokes because that technically would have been a week ago that would have been a week, but we don't know yet and our our audience won't know if you're listening to this on Monday, but you will if you listen to it later in the week. We have an NCAA National Championship basketball game that's supposed to be happening. We don't know who's in the finals yet, but we do know a Final Four, and one of those are your very own, auburn Tigers.

Rhett: 2:20

The ones you threw under the bus the other day.

Justin: 2:23

Well they lost. I would never throw them under the bus.

Rhett: 2:25

Oh okay, no, they're good, I'm rooting for them, you know, even on their bad day they still pull it out. They have not been playing 100% in my opinion, and yet they still find a way to win.

Justin: 2:35

And isn't it wild that they are playing once again.

Rhett: 2:45

You guys already know what happened here, but the this past weekend, auburn and florida would have played.

Justin: 2:47

Yeah, so that's been a nightmare team for for auburn.

Rhett: 2:49

I hope they're able to overcome it and while I'm able to talk with confidence right now yeah, you know, the week before the game in san antonio- it's still like we'll see you know people will listen to this and go oh, man, you know you're right, houston, and duke so I am not to throw this one way or the other, because anything can happen. We'll see if we'll be celebrating on the next episode. I think it comes down to how well the teams travel.

Justin: 3:12

Yeah.

Rhett: 3:13

And when I say teams, I'm referring to the crowd Right, because that has played a huge part in Atlanta for Auburn and it's been.

Justin: 3:21

These arenas are huge. I mean, aren't they probably playing in one of those ridiculous? It's like a football. I don't know I'm making this up, but usually there's so many seats in the back they do a good job covering the room up to make it feel that way, but I'm not sure if this is happening on one of those like a 40 000 seat capacity basketball is only able to get to about 20. Yeah it is but everybody's back spring break and as we are recording on our day, it's. April Fool's.

Justin: 3:53

It is, I've already been gotten by a couple. My wife sent me a great text earlier and she done got me. Oh, did she? That's fun, and I noticed some of our friends. I looked on socials and I noticed some some of our friends. I looked on socials and I saw some announcements they made and I didn't get to tell you cause you were looking at texts too. But I'm over here like oh wow, After about three wows on three different stories, I'm thinking what's going on today?

Rhett: 4:18

Oh yeah, you can't believe it.

Justin: 4:19

Then I had to go read the comments and people are like, yeah right, you can't really believe anything on social.

Rhett: 4:24

that much anyway, without having to like really deep dive fact check. But, on April Fool's.

Justin: 4:29

Day, for sure, yeah man.

Rhett: 4:32

Well, you and I used to live for April Fool's, though, man.

Justin: 4:34

Those are fun.

Rhett: 4:35

Man. I will never forget, and this probably says a lot about the trauma I deal with as a kid. What was it Growing up, I always wanted a dirt bike like I remember that having a motorcycle. My buddy had one. We had always go ride and I was like I want my own right now. I'm a kid, I don't know how 12, 13 years old you were always extreme sports kind of guy yeah, and so my dad picked me up after school.

Rhett: 5:00

We were going down to captain d's to eat and because Captain D's like, depending on the side of the country you're in, like it could be Long John Silver's but Captain D's is just deep fried fish and french- fries it's like man, caloric intake of nothing but fried food and carbohydrates there are no. Green is whatever it is, it's white.

Justin: 5:22

It's flaky. I don't know where it came from. Carbohydrates, good old cod. There are no green. No green, good old codfish.

Rhett: 5:24

Whatever it is, I love it. It's white, it's flaky, I don't know where it came from.

Justin: 5:27

They have corn on the cob, oh, so good.

Rhett: 5:30

And I have not eaten there in forever. But for the sake of this story, I'll never forget Like this traumatized me my dad's taking me to Captain you at home when we get home. I'm like what is it? You know, it's what you've been asking for for a long. I'm like what do you? What I've asked for a lot of things dad like, he's like just just guess.

Rhett: 5:51

And I was like, oh, and then I finally got to it. I said this I forgot what kind of bike it was, but it was like a dirt bike. He's like yep it's sitting there waiting on you when you get home man, that's amazing and I was like, oh my god, this is so amazing, this is so great, I can't wait to do the best that ever. And then, after I kind of came down from that, he said in april fools no, he didn't.

Justin: 6:13

I remember you getting a dirt bike, yeah, like five years later. Oh he, that's a terrible. That's a terrible.

Rhett: 6:21

I'm like oh man, but you, but you got to. You know the context. Single dad, you know what happened. Right, I have no idea. You got Rick Roll. What is that? You don't remember this song? I don't know.

Justin: 6:34

My kids tell me that's what it's called.

Rhett: 6:35

I have no idea. It's the.

Justin: 6:36

Never Gonna Give you Up. Okay, is that an 80s song? Yeah, remember, never gonna give you up, never.

Rhett: 6:42

Never gonna give you up, never gonna hurt you, never gonna turn around and hurt you, but you did Dad. And here I am, 20-something years, let's see 22. No, 30-something years later. Yeah, you know, yeah, dealing with my emotions and my trauma on Armchair Authentic.

Justin: 7:01

But you finally got one, and you got jet skis and you got other stuff yeah, so back it up for a second.

Rhett: 7:07

Moved to texas early 20s. I called my dad up on april fools and I'm still holding on to this because, like, I'm gonna get my dad back. And so my dad oh my god, you're never gonna believe this. What's that? I said you know, out here in texas they have lottery. Yeah, I said man, I've been playing it. And I just I said I can't believe it, but I'm now a millionaire. I won the texas lottery, did you really?

Justin: 7:30

oh, yeah and uh and I said I can't, I don't even have work.

Rhett: 7:34

I like that, I like, I'm like, like I haven't gone to turn the ticket in, he's like, oh my god, really like he's and he's bought into it and he's like unbelievable. I was like dad, we're gonna pay off your mortgage.

Rhett: 7:44

I want to do this oh yeah, oh yeah, you are so bad yeah, and, uh, and, and and so he was like and he was like oh my god, this is amazing and I said, oh and dad, you remember when I was 12 you told me I got a dirt bike and I didn't april fools oh my gosh, and hey, kids, never do this to you y'all are one upping each other.

Justin: 8:04

Yeah, so that was in my early 20s, yeah, and I got him. It was bad. What did he do?

Rhett: 8:09

oh he was just like he saw his life a new life in front of him.

Justin: 8:14

He was he had that quick little moment where he's got his sunglasses on sitting on a boat sipping something and just having the best day of his life House paid off.

Rhett: 8:24

Yeah Well, you know, don't traumatize your kid when he's 12 and tell him you're getting a dirt bike. And then you did Payback is a good one. What is payback, Justin? What?

Justin: 8:33

do? They say it's a good one, payback's a good one. That's my nice way. I don't know, man, but anyway I'm not saying I should have done that.

Rhett: 8:43

And some people over here on the religious side are like honor your dad and your mother, so you'll live long and prosper with peace. And the prosperity part of the promise of God.

Justin: 8:52

That's so funny.

Rhett: 8:53

I've since worked all that out.

Justin: 8:54

I remember we were out one day and your dad wanted to take us. He wanted to get a dune buggy. Oh yeah, Do you remember?

Rhett: 9:02

that.

Justin: 9:05

I remember buggy oh yeah, do you remember that?

Rhett: 9:07

I remember it yeah, he bought it. We went to go meet with that guy, we took a test drive. Were you with us on that?

Justin: 9:11

yes, yes, because that's the first time I heard somebody talk in instead of like dollars. Yeah, I remember the your dad's like so what are you asking for it? And I remember him going 13 and I'm like, what does 13 mean? 1300? I didn't know yeah as a young kid I'm like 13 is that how much it was?

Justin: 9:29

yeah, he bought it for 1300 bucks yeah, because I was thinking does he mean 13 000? Does he mean because I'm over here like, how do you break? Yeah, break. How do you crack that code like what does that mean? And I just remember that look on his face and um, and then your dad like threw a counter at him.

Rhett: 9:44

Yeah.

Justin: 9:45

Would you do 11?

Rhett: 9:46

It's basically a Volkswagen, just the rails.

Justin: 9:49

And they call that a rail job.

Rhett: 9:50

So it just was like a Volkswagen without any of the parts on it. It had a. You remember this, Remember the gas tank and that thing.

Justin: 9:57

No.

Rhett: 9:58

It was a keg.

Justin: 9:59

Really.

Rhett: 10:00

Yeah, so it was a hand-built welded together. So it was a hand-built, you know, you know welded together, and it was great. I mean it was a lot of fun. For sure, we drove it everywhere it was so fun what was the point of that and I had it the gas tank. Yeah was a was a beer keg that did not no doubt I was like okay, I didn't even know what that was. Did you like want?

Justin: 10:21

one. It was totally, totally right now. What was that? He just would buy these really cool.

Rhett: 10:25

My dad had his own business and he would do well, and when he did well, he would always buy something fun. Yeah, Well, so, but all this about April Fool's like yeah, I've got trauma around this.

Justin: 10:39

And so.

Rhett: 10:39

I married the most amazing woman in the world who cannot stand no jokes. Married the most amazing woman in the world who cannot stand no jokes. No like, let's laugh and have a good time, but I don't.

Justin: 10:50

I don't do well with you trying to lie to my face? You know, on one day of the year, yeah right, and you know, don't go, it's which is I love her so much for that.

Rhett: 10:57

So I've learned really quick, you know okay, all right, I know you know, all like us growing up watching america's funniest videos and stuff. You know like people would scare the living crap out of each other. I don't know how people do some of that.

Justin: 11:09

Like I thought back in the day, it's over the top.

Rhett: 11:11

Yeah, back in the day, though, I thought it was hilarious, and now I'm kind of on the other side going. That's not funny, and here's why I'll see jokes they do on different lens. And I never saw it through the lens of trauma. Oh man. I'm like yeah you're right, there is a lot of trauma there.

Justin: 11:31

Yeah, time goes by fast.

Rhett: 11:33

At their expense. We're getting a lot of laughter off of this, but still unhealthy. It's like we were 15 yesterday and we're, you know, in our 40s now it will fly by. It's crazy.

Justin: 11:48

Speaking of flying by, I mean, we've experienced a lot of life transitions, man, oh my god, I would say this year, our past six months, you know, going back at the time of this recording, you know, kind of the fall of 2024 into the know. Here we are now in 25. Yeah, we have, I mean there's been a lot of transition, you know, for us to even speak to in general. And I know, with what you do, even with ministry, you've been working with some pastors who have, you know, kind of had the baton passing kind of deal. Have you know, kind of had the baton passing kind of deal, but just a little more intimately with us? You know, first of all, in 2024, one of our early episodes we interviewed Pastor Randy Williams as he was passing the baton right. So obviously we set up for that, but that was just such a special moment to actually watch him pass that to. You know another pastor, pastor Ron. But also, you know and we can go back to that one too, but as you fast forward, you know, and for the majority of time for you too, but really for the whole time for me, since 2001,. Church of the Islands was planted and me and Summer, we've been there since February when it launched. Yeah, there since February when it launched, but Pastor Chris Hodges has been my pastor, I mean for the past 24 years.

Justin: 13:11

I think you know this happened a couple of months ago at the time of this recording, but you know, just to really, I think, to at least bring it up, really to fully honor you know who he is in our life and you know I'm talking now, so specifically in my life, in February he passed the baton and that's, I mean, that was such a big deal because he, you know, you could feel the, you could feel a transition coming, being a part of the organization. There's a lot of vision he has. We talk a lot about Highlands College and he has had such a heart for that. For I mean, what, since 2011, when it really launched as a college, going through the accreditation process, and I knew he wanted to put a lot of focus on that. He's been telling that to us as a team for a long time, but it's always surreal when it really happens. So he transitioned fully. There was a transition of role into stepping into founding pastor and also continuing his role as chancellor of Highlands College. A lot of vision for that.

Justin: 14:16

And he passed the baton to Mark Pettis, who has also really been at Highlands since the beginning season he and his wife Jill really started dating and they began that whole courtship and now they've been married four boys really starting a fresh transition there as the new lead pastor of Church of the Highlands, but I kind of look back at what we've been through the past six months. It's just, the timing is really it's just. It's really interesting, just the timing for us as we've grown up. Now in our 40s, we're getting to see some of these things that we've heard our pastors talk about. We've heard our pastors talk about passing, when they had the baton passed to them or, in this case, when Pastor Randy took over a church as an associate pastor under Mark Correll, who I also want to pause there and honor. Pastor Mark Correll recently passed away, so he is with Jesus now. And man talk about a guy who planted early seeds for us.

Rhett: 15:24

Yeah.

Justin: 15:25

Even before I was surrendered, I remember going to Parkway just so I could walk home after my dad dropped me off, because he would go down the street to Cathedral and I would go there and I would listen to the music. But then I'd walk home but I would stay a lot of times because Mark Correll was so captivating. But I would stay a lot of times because Mark Correll was so captivating and the way he communicated, just charismatic, always had something to capture your attention, yeah, and so I was always just wowed by just the presence that he really just had about him. He brought in Pastor Randy as an associate pastor and I don't know the politics of it and we, you know obviously I'm not even being sensitive to it because I don't know what to be sensitive to but people happen or humans happen. We all got our agenda, something ruffled feathers, I'm sure, here and there. That ultimately led to Mark Correll no longer being the pastor of Parkway and the church was experiencing amazing growth, like it was one of the fastest growing churches in the Southeast. As someone who really didn't care about any of that, I just went to go find a seat. I remember thinking I can't even find a place to sit down because people were so hungry to come into this house and I remember when he wasn't there and he ends up taking the pastoral role down the street at a church called Cathedral of the Cross. This is all in Birmingham, alabama. I know we have over 500 cities around the country that listen to this. This is in our space in Birmingham Alabama and Mark Correll took on being the pastor there and you had overnight. I remember coming back to Parkway and it was like a ghost town. Yeah, you went from flourishing and do you remember that it was like you might have 150 people People, 200 people there.

Justin: 17:26

Pastor Randy, who came as an associate pastor, as he shared in his podcast. I'd encourage you to go back and listen to it. He didn't really know he was going to be the pastor, but all of a sudden now he's the pastor About that time, maybe a year into. That is when you and I surrender our life to Christ and we really get bought into Parkway. That became our place to get planted. So great things are happening at cathedral with mark carrell.

Justin: 17:51

So to pause there, I did want to at least acknowledge just the work that he did 100, truly such a world changer, and not just the, just the way to just throw that out. I mean, he had such an impact one of the greatest series you could hear on the teaching of revelations and did so many trips to Israel. He knew it better than any tour guide would have known it. He probably knew the actual spaces where stuff would happen. Just such an amazing man who's now gone before us. When I read it I was actually playing guitar one night Before I went to bed. I just kind of looked at socials and I saw his wife literally had just posted it and it just kind of got my heart. It was that moment of even though he was really never my pastor. He was kind of like that pastoral figure from afar where me and you would still go to cathedral and do some things we might jump in and help with there.

Justin: 18:45

He was such a visionary. They would have these Halloween alternatives like Revelations House or Judgment House, or he would do something.

Rhett: 18:53

It's a haunted house for Christians. We literally scare the hell out of you.

Justin: 18:58

It really would. That's what it was. It was, and he was such a visionary. His would always be the best.

Rhett: 19:03

If you want to Me and you would find ourselves we're going to go all out on the hell scenes. I just remember we would go there and be a part of what he did and we just felt connected.

Justin: 19:15

It would take you through a story and I didn't go to the church, but he let us be a part of it, and so we would talk kind of in the hallways where what we would call our dream team are hanging out in between the volunteers that were the actors for this. We'd hang out and I would just be back there eating with them and me and him would just have these great conversations and I always felt very close to him. But he was never my pastor in that kind of sense, but just such a respect for the ministry of Mark Correll and what he did as a part of that city and really what he served as, really as a you know within cities, you know in a spiritual sense too that I believe you've got these places who've already established ground Right, they've already been digging, and so when you come into a city it's wise to understand who's already been there so that you don't go just build a new foundation but you can build upon the spiritual foundation already laid. And I would say Mark Correll was one of those figureheads who when you came in town to maybe plan a church, or when you came in town to start something, he was one of those guys that you would go to to to not necessarily get permission, but just let him know. Here's what I'm praying about doing, just to have him give you that hey, I'm for you, man Right, which he was very much a hands like, hands off, like go for it, champion, empower you to do it. And so that was just kind of a moment to honor Pastor Mark Correll, because, man, he'll be missed.

Justin: 20:52

I feel like I watched he would have these things on Facebook that, even if you're listening, you could look up Mark Correll Ministries and he would have these in the news and they would happen every week and I would find myself doing dishes as I normally do in our editor, our podcast now, but even through COVID before that, he was always talking about world events, watch out for this to happen. And it's and he would do it based on end times and it's amazing how many times it would be spot on. And I remember during COVID season, like he had cancer in the past and it came back and I remember he had to get actually put on a ventilator and these are, you know, during COVID. It's like if you had COVID and cancer, it was, in essence, a death sentence, because when they would put you on these ventilator that there's a great chance you're saying your goodbyes, yeah.

Rhett: 21:56

I had a friend of mine pass away during COVID. I remember that. Yeah, it was really sad. Isaac Babcock, yeah man.

Justin: 22:03

Good dude.

Rhett: 22:04

Yeah.

Justin: 22:05

And yeah, man, that was so many people went through some really sad stuff during that and I think people were setting up that that's going to happen with with Mark Correll as well, and so many prayers and we don't know why God decides to let some come back and some not, cause ultimately we know a miracle's done because we, no matter what, we're in eternity, so it's the win-win. But in this case he did not pass and he kept getting better and he came back.

Justin: 22:36

So next thing you know, months later, it's a long time he's doing in the news and I'm listening to it almost just astounded with God. Thank you for letting us hear his voice some more. And, of course, now as we're talking, he transitioned into eternity. Now we're talking about, as we started our conversation, pastor Randy handed over the church that he took over 33, 34, 35 years ago and has just now passed that baton. And then my pastor for the past 24 years passed the baton 24 years after taking on his next step. And it's just really interesting. There's almost this very I say it with all the respect in the world, but there's also just that sacredness sacredness about it when I talk about it, just seeing these great men who've accomplished some really great things, who had a very, very big impact on my life and continue to have an impact on my life.

Rhett: 23:42

It's just wild to see us at this stage of life where we're starting to see transitions, just like many who have been our age and older now have seen some of these begin to happen yeah, for me, when I think about you know the mindset when you're 16, 17, 18 years old at least, for me, 30 years seems like eternity, yeah, and so we're walking at that age into a season of hearing stories about how the church was founded and new pastor, right. And so we were not really old enough to have lived through that type of transition or to understand that transition. So we're only living in the legacy of who founded the church and who, you know, founded planted pastors that have served In that day. If you remember, there were always pictures of pastors who founded the church in the hallway.

Rhett: 24:38

It was always an oil painting, yeah Right, and it's got the pastor's faces on the wall, sometimes a little creepy, looking too Like a little bit.

Rhett: 24:48

I know, especially in like more. I don't know if the baptist churches I'd go to you would see, you know, and it seemed like wow, there's an old dude who started this thing, and then there's another old dude who we passed it off to, and here's another old dude, right, but, um, you know, parkway wasn't that old so, but I remember, was it robert smith, the guy who founded the church?

Justin: 25:04

bob smith.

Rhett: 25:05

Yeah, okay, so he got by the name of Bob Smith, and so his picture's up there.

Rhett: 25:09

And as a kid. I'm looking at that, I'm not really understanding the context, or just even the leadership and all that it takes, the obedience, the sacrifice, all the stuff Right, but then so then we live life and we've lived it up to. You know, I'm 47. So you know, 30 plus years now. And now we're in a season where we're seeing the people that were our leaders and I say were some still are in different capacities, making transitions, and I'm thinking man, how did we get here? You know, if I'm looking at my life, I'm going golly, 30 years seems like forever, but very short at the same time. And here we are, and now I say we, me, I'm reflecting and looking and going wow, 30 years isn't really that long you know, and.

Rhett: 25:58

I'm looking at. Well, in another 30 years, you know, 50, 60, 70, you know it. Just, I don't know. My life goes by really quick, so I don't know. Yeah, it's interesting that this past year has been a lot of transition. You know, if I look back, I mean we I transitioned to church, and then, you know, pastor Randy transitioned to church, and then I've got, uh, another buddy who transitioned to church, and all guys who have, you know, were faithful and obedient and doing everything that they could, and and then now pastor Chris Hodges transitions the church. And it's all a part of the natural progression in life. It is, and it's a healthy thing and it's a beautiful thing when done right. Unfortunately, there are not a lot of places that do it well and I'm grateful that I'm seeing things being done at least better from what I've told. How things have been in the past with transitions.

Rhett: 26:48

Yeah, absolutely, because a lot of times transitions can either done at least better from what I've told how things have been in the past with transitions yeah, absolutely Setting, because a lot of times transitions can either, if they're not done right, they can set up. I mean, that baton pass that you mentioned is really pivotal in the fact of whether or not you're going to win the race. Yeah, that's right, you know they call it the baton relay, right? The most pivotal part is that transition and how it's passed and how it's set up for the next runner, because if you fail on that or you drop it or you miss a step or whatever, it's crucial on whether or not, in church terms, whether or not people are going to remain, stay, continue, move forward.

Justin: 27:24

It's definitely not the space for ego.

Rhett: 27:27

No, because you will not the space for ego?

Justin: 27:28

No, because you will not. You will not make it with ego because, as you said a while ago, yeah, we're going to forget people if it's successful, like some of these churches you're talking about that are there over 100 years old. You've got generations of pastors, yeah, which means you've probably got the older guy who, let's just say, his 80s, who is in a church somewhere and he could be the founder, and people are walking by him the whole time and they have no clue. They don't know the work that that husband and wife dug on those grounds for decades and quarter centuries and half a century. You don't know the ground that's been plowed. And so if you have an ego to look at it like I'm here to build a name, you're doing it for the wrong reason, because you will be forgotten. Even if your name is placed on something, your face will be forgotten. But we never have done it to let our face be remembered throughout history. We're here to build legacy. We're here to build a ground that our children and our children's children are going to build upon.

Justin: 28:44

So ego is what? When you're talking about some of them haven't gone good or gone well, it's because a lot of times not every time, but a lot of times there's an ego there that can't let go. Or there's an ego there who might have an agenda to try to finagle things, to work out in a certain way, because they don't know that there's an ego. But they have self-medicated for years, not on porn, not on affairs, not on food, not on the obvious sins that we would say. But there's people out there. They've medicated on ministry. Yeah, the platform identity the platform They've medicated on ministry. Yeah, the platform identity the platform They've medicated.

Justin: 29:31

We can get trapped as ministers to medicate on me. Helping you is almost like a medication to me, like I got to feel, like I got to go help somebody and sometimes, as weird as it sounds, that can be your downfall. As weird as it sounds, that can be your downfall, because it's so set up on what you can do for somebody else. When sometimes God is like I just want you to sit still and be content in me and not get any of your satisfaction from any temporary fixes, including helping others, only what you can get from me, including helping others, only what you can get from me. And so when you are a pastor who's going to hand something off. You've got to walk with that humility to understand I'm truly empowering the next generation and, as we've said before, empowerment means you're giving up some of your influence or a lot of your influence in this case.

Rhett: 30:26

Hey guys, red here Just want to take a moment and say thank you to every single one of you who have taken the time to follow us on social media. Now, if today is your first time to join us for an episode, man, we want to say welcome, friends, it's so good to have you with us. Could you take a moment look us up on Instagram or Facebook? You can find us there at Armchair Authentic, or you can go on over to X find us there as well, at Armchair Auth Pod. That's Armchair Auth A-U-T-H-P-O-D. All right, now back to the conversation.

Justin: 31:03

And, as we've said before, empowerment means you're giving up some of your influence or a lot of your influence, in this case so that the next generation can take it and build upon your back and you step into being a pillar.

Rhett: 31:12

Yeah, Well, you're preaching to the choir right now because I had to walk this, I know, like, if somebody is listening to this and saying, well, y'all don't know, no, we do know and I know a lot of you know. I appreciate, you know the qualification there. There are people who have planted in, in, in put 25, 30 years of their life into the one place you know, and then how to make those transitions. You know, transition is hard, no matter how you look. But I love that you're speaking to ego and humility because, um, we, you know, are we Christ followers? Yes, are we human, absolutely. And I would say when we transitioned the church I mean, we planted the church in 2018, one Life Church in Idaho, nampa but it was built off of, you know, 25 years or so of ministry, of faithfulness and serving, and you know so it wasn't an overnight thing, you know. So when we planted the church, you know, the church grew, the church was successful.

Rhett: 32:13

I would have never dreamed that God would have called me away from that to pass the baton after about four and a half years and move into a new season, and some people might think, well, that was easier to do because you're only four and a half years in I'm like no, that was one of the hardest things we've ever had to do. In fact, I had a guy ask me one time. He said what's easier planning a church or transitioning a church? And I said, oh my God, it's a lot harder to transition a church. You know it's planning a church, it's honeymoon. Is it hard? Does it take faith? Yeah, absolutely. But there's so many hard parts about transition because the human side is. You know, if you're being completely honest, it's like this is your identity.

Rhett: 32:51

Whether you can say, man, yeah, we're building this church on Jesus Christ. Yes, you are, but at the same time, the reality is that there's an identity tied into what you've done and so, and not only that, but the relationships, the I don't relationships, the word isn't power, but the idea of being on a platform, being able to speak into people's lives, and in the value that you get, and the affirmation and the feeling of purpose and fulfillment that comes from that is big and so, yeah, so walking in humility is huge. It takes a lot of humility to pass the baton and I tell people a lot when they're talking about transitions. You can tell the transitions that are healthy, based off the ones who didn't build the church off of a personality yeah, that's right, because the ones that were truly based off of Christ and not a personality are the ones that continue to go on and go forward and continue to do great things. Right, and I'm grateful for that for one life. But what I will say specifically to what we're talking about with ego and humility is that, man, it took a lot of there's. I don't. I don't pride myself in the fact that we walked with humility, but I do pride myself in the fact, because I'm grateful for what's happening now. But even after four years of serving, you're right, people forget you real quick, and they should.

Rhett: 34:12

I always told people when we launched the church and we were speaking vision. I was always like, hey guys, listen, we're not here to make a name. You know, this isn't about us or our personality, this is about Jesus, right, yeah, and it will always be that way. And we worked really, really, really hard to make it all about Christ and that's why small groups were such a big deal for us. It's because I wanted this church not to rely on a Sunday morning experience. I wanted it to rely on the relationships, no matter who the pastor was or who was speaking, but, man, the humility it took to go. Okay, we're going to pass the baton to new people and I'm going to walk into a season of obscurity, away from what I thought was legacy. And it's still a part of legacy. I get that, but like identity and and all of that, I mean dude, that's hard, yeah. And so I have mad respect and love for pastors who have planted and pass batons in a healthy way, because, you know, it's a good thing that people forget who you are.

Justin: 35:10

Yeah, and it's a humble thing and it is a process that God walks you through because you know you really find out man.

Rhett: 35:16

Is my identity tied to what I'm doing or who God is? You know? And who I am in Christ.

Justin: 35:24

Such a deal. I think so many people would listen and say man, it hits in so many areas. Humility, humility, humility. It has to be humility, because the very thing that you get called to on mission there is a constant tension. To be effective, you have to have some of these traits that are the very thing that can lead you to ego. And it is a constant guarding your heart. And at the wellspring of life, we are told to guard our heart. We really cannot put our guard down.

Justin: 36:08

Even Jesus, after fasting 40 days, he's being taken to all these places. Obviously, he's not going to be taken by Satan. He's allowing this temptation to happen, but he's still being tempted and he's being offered all this stuff, which are basically shortcuts, the notoriety, all the stuff that comes with it. He had to be on guard to actually speak the word of God back to Satan. And we're. I mean, if Jesus needed to be on guard and ready, who are we to think that we don't have to be and to be ministers? It might seem that, well, I don't. I'm not, I'm not partaking in the secular environments. I'm over here. Well, there's still shadows to everything that we do and my ego can be tempted as much in the ministry realm. Oh, 100%, all the time, all the time.

Rhett: 37:05

Well, ego, I think you know ego can get a bad rap really quick. I think what I hear you saying is you know there has to be a side of ego. Let's call it confidence, a confident humility. Yeah, you know, you've got to have this ability to lead people with vision. Yeah, to step out when nobody else will, to say this is who we are, this is where we're going. Who wants to join me? Let's go. And this is right, this is what it's going to look like and be able to say here's our vision, here's our mission, here's our values that are going to drive this thing and man, we want everybody to be a part. And here's what, if you, if you will, what it could look like, you know, and how it could change your life and your family and a lot of different things. And so that type of leadership does take a type of ego that's willing to step out, but when that's done in a prideful way, where it's like look how great I am, I'm a great leader and I'm the best.

Rhett: 38:00

Well then, that's unhealthy, but when you're able to go, man, I have pride in who Christ is and my boldness, you know, and in this power is not a me but of Christ, and but I'm, I'm confident in who God's called me to be and I'm confident who he is, with 100% humility.

Justin: 38:17

Yeah, Well then that, there you go, then that's the win-win right, and the thing is, when you're looking at yourself, at least the word of God is being preached, right. So you still had something that happened where God is sovereign.

Justin: 38:29

Yeah, you know when I'm coaching or training people to coach or counsel. It's like there's three stages that you can look at, and I think this is something we all start at stage one and we're growing, hopefully, to stage three. But you can put this in counseling. You could put this in planting. You could put this in doing your job every day. You can put this in counseling. You could put this in planting. You could put this in doing your job every day. But in stage one, you're doing your job with the thought of how am I looking in this?

Rhett: 38:56

So if I'm counseling somebody, I'm giving you guidance.

Justin: 39:04

But stage one as a new counselor, I'm thinking how am I doing? Are they getting? Are they feeling this from me? Stage two you grow into okay, I really want to help them. I want to help them.

Justin: 39:15

And that seems like the ultimate. I want to help them. Can I help them with everything that they're saying right now? This is going to ooh, this is a big one. Okay, how can I help them?

Justin: 39:35

Stage three that we want to live in is where is God in all this? What's God doing in all this? So now, when you're talking to me, I'm not thinking about how I'm looking. I'm not thinking about just you being helped. I'm trying to look through the mindset of where can we see God in what you're going through, whether you just made a terrible mistake and you're confessing something, or you're celebrating something that happens, or you're asking curious questions on how can I get better.

Justin: 40:02

If you look at it from the mindset of what is God doing in this greater picture, it changes everything. So, as a pastor, you could build something that is wonderful and big, that the world is looking at saying, wow, aren't you awesome? But if you can keep your eyes, even as that leader, to say, god, what are you doing in all this? That's a place of humility that you know. I'll use Pastor Chris as an example, one thing that you know. I've always just been drawn to what he does, and I've seen a lot of people who you know. Like me, we've come up under him for 24 years. We tend to reflect those who mentor us right and you can't help it. Sometimes you just look like the people you've been with for a long time.

Justin: 40:46

Yeah, and I love one thing that he says, and maybe he got this from a mentor to him, I'm not sure, but anytime he gets an applause, I think he does this too, because he knows that he could if he was left to his own devices. Just like you, just like me, just like his mentors, his pastors, we will buy into our own press clippings, and so anytime he's been given an introduction and he comes on the stage, he could say, and it wouldn't be wrong, he could say thank you, thank you, take your seats. But what does he always do?

Justin: 41:18

Yeah, he turns up, All right even give five, go 10 seconds, even louder, for Jesus. He wants to make sure that the loudest applause was not him, to make sure that the loudest applause was not Him. And that is a great little reminder of those triggers that we have to set to remind us that we're not buying into something. Because, god, what are you doing in this greater picture and what that allows to be done? You infuse hope into every situation where, no matter how dark or how great things are, because you know, when things are great, that sometimes that's the least time we think we need God. We got it from here, god, right. But whether it's great mountaintop or it's the deepest valley, if we can look and say, where is hope in this picture, god, what are you doing right now in this situation? Right?

Rhett: 42:06

now in this situation and I appreciate the imagery of the three stages. That can apply in every area of your life, as a mom, as a dad, you know. Obviously, in anything you're trying to accomplish, my mind always goes toward preaching and teaching and communication, because that's something that I've been very blessed and able to do, and so I don't think and you could this is a conversation, but I don't think you can get to stage three without going through one and two. Personally, I can see that, because we all have to be developed.

Rhett: 42:41

I know for sure.

Justin: 42:42

I've had to.

Rhett: 42:43

And I look at it like you know, a baby's don't go from like being in your arms to running a marathon. They just don't Right. They have to learn how to crawl and then they have to learn how to keep their balance and then, once they kept their balance, they learn how to put a foot in front of the other, and there's a whole process to it. So but I think, well, when it's easy for people to hear this and go well, I should just be living in stage three. And while that may be the absolute place that we're all hoping to arrive to, I think you would be doing yourself an injustice to think that you could just jump there overnight, because I'll take it through the lens of preaching or anything you want to do.

Rhett: 43:24

But for preaching or teaching or communication, standing on a platform singing, when you do that for the first time, there's a lot of insecurities because you're putting yourself out there and you're making yourself very vulnerable and the human nature is I really hope I'm connecting and I hope I'm doing a good job. But when you do that, then you get your feedback and you learn. Well, I didn't do the best and I could get better. And after so many reps of doing that, you get to a place to realize you know what I'm confident now and it really doesn't matter what people think, because I'm doing this based out of the grace and based out of gift and based out of my love for this now and my passion is I really do want to help people.

Justin: 44:06

Yeah.

Rhett: 44:06

Right. And then you're kind of transitioning out of that stage of what do I look like, what do I sound like? You know what? I don't really care. I'm really now doing this. I really want to help people. Yeah, I really want to help people, which is great, and that's all a part of it.

Rhett: 44:27

And the more you do that, the God in the midst of every stage right, it's not like God's not in the first or the second, he's a part of all that. But you get to a point of confidence, ability to be able to stand up and to be very present in the moment, to realize, yeah, I might have prepared for this, but I really feel in my heart that I need to share this. But I really feel in my heart that I need to share this, even though I didn't plan for this. But I'm confident in my ability to help people but also to respond to God in the moment, to say what needs to be said, even if I didn't plan for it, because that's ultimately what God wants to be said in this moment for this individual or this person or whatever the scenario. That's. That's kind of how I filter through the stage one, two, two and three, because there's no way.

Rhett: 45:09

I had the heart to be in three, but I had to go through one and two to get there. Yeah, same, but God was always in the midst of it. But I had to go through the whole idea of man. I wonder how I am connecting. Oh, this is going well. Sure, you know how Well, sure, you know how do I sound man? Was I flat? Was I? Good you know and then and then move into the. You know what. I don't care what people think. As long as I help somebody, I'm good.

Justin: 45:33

And you can get to the point where you want to help somebody so much, yeah, that you you actually short change them from what they can learn by not being helped.

Rhett: 45:44

Hey, friends, just want to take a moment and say, if you are enjoying today's conversation, could you do us a huge favor? Would you take a moment and copy the link from your favorite podcast platform and share it with a friend? Email it to a friend. How about air dropping it over to your buddy or your sister right now? Man, that would mean so much to us. Thank you, all right guys. Back to the conversation.

Justin: 46:08

And you can get to the point where you want to help somebody so much, yeah, that you you actually short change them from what they could learn by not being helped.

Justin: 46:19

That's really good so to actually give them the feedback of. You know, I met with someone the other day and they were asking questions like how can I improve on this? Hey, what is being said about me? Like they were just curious. It was great curious human questions that we would ask what could I do here? And in the past I think I would have answered to help them.

Justin: 46:43

And it was just that greater question, because now I'm a lot more sensitive to it and I was telling you stage three, it's my natural thought to look at it and even sometimes, if I'm close to the person, is to stop with them and say, hey, where's God in all this? Like this question's a good, it can be a good question in the right moment. But is this the right moment? Because I think that you're asking this question more out of an insecurity and it's not the right question to even be asking. But what is God teaching you with what you're feeling right now, in this moment?

Justin: 47:18

Yeah, and it was one of those, um, it was one of those hang times with somebody where you almost just have to sit, still a little bit, and that's uncomfortable. But we just got quiet after I said it and we're just kind of staring at each other, kind of like me and you were doing right now, and that's hard for me in the past, because I want to jump in and not let the silence linger. I want to jump in and go ahead and fix it, but just to let that question settle on them and stay quiet and let the time take, however much time it needs to take, and then the meeting might end and I might even leave where that insecure side remember, we said you always got a shadow that's going to kick in. I still leave those meetings, tempting myself to analyze, like God, what if I would've just given him the answer, yeah, like how did I do, lord?

Justin: 48:14

I wonder if that was the? Did they even like that? Like I still jump into that. And here I am helping them. Now I'm driving back to my office analyzing the mess out of my conversation because I could have been the hero of the moment and I would have left. But instead and let me just throw this out Instead I left a little more humble because I felt a little more incapable, like I felt like I almost did not do my, my, my role, of my knowledge, that the knowledge I had could have done more for that person.

Rhett: 48:53

Yeah.

Justin: 48:53

And so I didn't get the satisfaction of completion to that moment. It's like we talked about before I didn't get the amen and I could have asked for the amen, so they gave it to me and I feel better, yeah, but instead I left more in a condition of more humble, like I don't even know how I did. But they left and I have to believe, I have to have faith. They left pondering because I didn't just give them the answer they were looking for and they're now chewing on it and the growth that they're going to have is greater by me feeling less satisfied by the answer that I gave them.

Rhett: 49:31

Isn't that a deep thought? Well, it is a very deep thought, and the reality is our hope as leaders, when we're helping and developing people, isn't that we have all the answers, but we help them learn how to discover. How should I say it? We help them be God aware in every moment, to where they can hear from the Lord and what is it that God is teaching them, and not only how to hear from him, but how to come up with the answer on their own in this moment.

Rhett: 50:04

You know one of the greatest things as a parent you know, and one of the greatest things as a parent you know, and one of the, I say, greatest, one of the hardest things as a parent is not doing everything for your kid all the time when you could do it and get it done and here's the answer and go, and it's hard to go. I know the answer and I could give you the answer to this, but I want you to figure it out and you need to sit in that moment and you need to sit with your frustration. You need to sit and see, allow God to be in that moment with you and to learn what it is. You need to learn in the process that you need to process, and that's hard to do because we live in a society and a culture where, no, give me step one, two, three, just give me the answer so I can move on and keep moving forward. But sometimes the best thing is to sit in it, and I've always, I think, if I I can't say I've always gotten it right.

Rhett: 50:52

But when I look at my own life and a lot of the crazy situations that I've been, I feel like 90% of the time I've tried to be like David in the Bible, to be very God aware in the Bible, to be very God aware. To what can I learn from this? This is difficult, this is a desert moment, this is hard, but yet, god, you're right in the midst of this. Not that you caused this, but due to decisions I've made or decisions other people have made. Here we are. But, lord, what can I learn in and through this so I can grow from it? So either A never experience it again, but, more importantly, how can I help somebody else in the future who may go through this as well so good you know and help them in a way to, like you said, you know, not always fix it, but help them in the development of the discovery process of their own God, awareness of how to fix it themselves.

Justin: 51:50

Yeah.

Rhett: 51:51

And that may sound cruel. Just give me the frigging answer, man.

Justin: 51:54

Right, you got the key to unlock the door.

Rhett: 51:56

Give it to me and I'm like, yeah, well, I mean, but you've got the access to it and you're going to learn more.

Justin: 52:02

Yeah, your gift may rise up in that moment. Yeah, but your character doesn't get developed, so your gifts outpace your character, and having to figure it out helps character development. Yes, that's the key.

Justin: 52:15

We're on a slow growth mindset even though we're surrounded by a microwave and do it quick, and that's why a lot of people don't become the pillars. Do it quick and that's why a lot of people don't become the pillars. They uproot and they move, they move. They move because it's hard to actually get stable at a place, because it's just we're not getting, I'm not getting the answer I want from this person. Maybe over here this person would give me more of my answers that I want or I don't get to do this here, but I bet over there they would celebrate this part of me and your statement really might be a true statement.

Justin: 52:54

But does that mean what you think is your best is God's best Was a great lesson we learned from Pastor Randy last year. Is your best, god's best? And it's not always the case. What we've learned in very? You used that word a while ago, but it was just kind of the hidden, just obscurity. I don't want anybody giving me a prophetic word like you're going to live an obscure life, but you know what? I might not want that.

Justin: 53:26

But if I actually live that, it might be, and I think about. I think about John Larson, who's you know, he's executive pastor. He's been on the lead team at Highlands for a long time and now he oversees ministry training. He's a VP for the college and I remember him telling me that once you know once again his story to tell, but the commercial version of it would be that he had had someone tell him a long time ago. Like you're going to lead in an obscurity.

Rhett: 53:59

And as a young dream-minded kid he's got big vision. I always remember him telling me I didn't really love that.

Justin: 54:05

I always remember him telling me I didn't really love that, but the benefits that have come because he's in my opinion it's been not obscure at all, but there has been so many decisions people like John have made that has not gone to pursue what would be the masses, because he has stayed focused and committed to what he knows God's mission is, in this case, the very man we're talking about, who just transitioned roles in founding pastor and now chancellor of the college. Pastor Chris, there's such a deep rooted focus on mission with what's going on at the college. Yeah, focus on mission with what's going on at the college yeah, and that's not necessarily seen by the masses but it is a good work. Yeah, and I'm very inspired by that.

Justin: 54:56

But you have to. You've got to walk the silent paths for a long time to and to not get distracted, to move and veer off thinking it's just not happening, it's too obscure. It's not the big dreams that I had Some of the greatest moments, as we've said, which has been a theme of our podcast the ordinary stuff that you're in right now that is leading to the very thing that you probably are feeling that God tugging your heart. It happens through this organic, very, maybe even obscure path that you're walking of faithfulness, of planting, of watering, of cultivating and to actually see harvest grow. You've now walked the quiet path. You've walked the long faithful years that have built your character to actually help you maintain and stay rooted as you've gotten taller, to actually be secure in what you're doing.

Rhett: 55:54

I think a lot of people would rather skip the process of persevering in obscurity and just jump to the flash in the pan platform moment as fast as I can and be seen, even if that means that it's short lived. You know, it's like that microwave moment, like I would rather have my 15 minutes of fame and get there as fast as I can and skip all that you know stuff and get there and have my 15 minutes of fame and then live the rest of my life in obscurity. You know, rather than go. No, there's beauty in obscurity and and and building perseverance and building character and building integrity and learning how to be refined in the fire Right, yeah, and the impurities that are drawn out in the fire Right and in the purities that rise to the top and really become something.

Rhett: 56:41

You know, when I say great, I don't I don't mean like success and fame and fortune, but like become somebody great and integrity and character and be somebody great with just being a man or woman of your word and and and and. Stick into hey, I said this and even though it hurts, I'm going to go through with it, you know, because this is who I am, right, and so a lot of people aren't willing to go that road and that's, and that's the very road that I think you know. Narrow is the road Right, wide is the road that leads to destruction, but narrow is the road that leads to life. And in so many Right, very few go that road Right Because it's the road less traveled. Yeah, using the, poetry moments.

Justin: 57:24

And if you're going to be the pillar that is built upon, that means you probably are going to be obscure because your pillar down, your foundation down. Yeah, you're not going to see that foundation always, but we cannot rise up if we don't have the backs to stand on. The people who've gone before us, like the Mark Corral's, the, Randy Williams.

Rhett: 57:49

What's left standing after a?

Justin: 57:50

tornado, the foundation.

Rhett: 57:52

That's it. Yep, everything else is pretty much mauled. Yeah. For those who don't live in tornado alleys like we do, yep, you know, like the things that happen when there's major storms that come through, you know, it's the foundation that lasts, yeah, and I think we should all strive to be foundations in our lives and in, in, in everything we do, not to say that there aren't moments where we will have shine and shimmer in those things, but at the end of the day, if I'm thinking about somebody who wants to last, right, everything that I want to do, really I'm like foundation. When you look at these, beautiful architect, notre Dame, notre Dame, notre Dame, depending on where you're from right, the cathedral over in France. Beautiful when it caught on fire, right, all the ornate stuff that was like seen, right, all of that was gone, right, but that foundation stood, yeah, you know, and and I think, if you're looking at your life is and they get to build it back yeah, they did upon the same foundation.

Rhett: 58:56

That was there because, yes, you know, and and I think there's a lot to be said about being a man or woman of character and and integrity and having a foundation that others can we've said this before you know we rise by lifting others up, by being a foundation, by being pillars, that and in the end, man, like I don't know. I was watching, we were watching this, uh, race car show, cause this is what my son loves so much and there was this woman who leads a team. At one point she was a race car driver, right, and now she's actually what they call a team principal. She's over an entire team and she had more tears and joy and fulfillment by helping these other race car drivers become great than she ever did when she was racing herself. Yeah, and I pointed that out to my son, I said I paused it. I said, hey, watch that.

Rhett: 59:52

Did you catch this? Do you know? Do you see what's happening right here in this moment? This is somebody who had a dream to be the greatest race car driver of all time. She's a woman and now she's got her own race team and she's got her own team and family and community and small groups and she's helping these other young race car drivers try to develop and become great. And then, when they do, she's like her success is now really driven by their success. And there's this fulfillment and there's this tie in and I'm like, I'm like, are you seeing this? Like I don't want you to miss this, because I know you want to become a race car driver. And that's great that you have that dream and and that's not obscure, because everybody can see that Right.

Rhett: 1:00:28

But look at this you know, look at this, are you seeing this? And it just, it was just a beautiful picture that kind of ties into what we're saying here of, just like you know, living a life of obscurity is. It doesn't mean you're not going to be fulfilled and all nobody's going to know. Like you know, man, like I don't think there's anything greater in my mind than being a foundation or a pillar or some type of support and developing others to see their dreams fulfilled, because when you live that type of life, it's amazing how much fulfillment comes back to you.

Justin: 1:00:55

It really is and you look back at that, it's so true. I'm so grateful that I did not get the things that I used to think that I wanted, because I'm getting to experience stuff now that I realized I would have missed out on and and I have been placed in family. You have been placed in family. The people we're surrounded with it's like you have been placed in these families, but you can't get placed there and it actually become something healthy unless you get planted. And so my encouragement is like get, get planted. Don't look for the shine, Don't look for all this stuff, but be planted somewhere with a people who have this common goal, this common mission, Missio Dei, where God wants to see everything restored back to his original specifications and run that race with people and get planted and watch what will happen.

Rhett: 1:02:00

We all want to be the fruitful tree, right, but none of us want to be planted to become that tree in other words none of us want to go into the dark place. That's the unseen, yeah, and everything that happens. That tree doesn't become that tree, yeah, without the process of being deeply rooted and planted. And if you think about being planted visually, what happens? You're putting this in dirt, yeah, and you're burying it, right. It's unseen.

Justin: 1:02:30

It actually. Unless the seed dies, it can't be fruitful, that's what I right.

Rhett: 1:02:35

And so you have to go if you want to become great and be that tree you know, using that metaphor or whatever analogy and be fruitful and be standing and last the, you know, through every season of life. Right, psalm 1,. Right, those who spend time in God's Word are like a tree who are planted by streams of water. Right, who yield as fruit in season. Whatever they do prospers. You don't get to that unless you go through the obscurity of being planting and actually dying in the dirt, where nobody's seen, and that's where that development comes from, in that process to when and eventually it sprouts. Right, and a little bit seen. But it's seen because of the integrity and the character and the perseverance and all the stuff it had to go through in the dark.

Justin: 1:03:21

Yes, and do you know that some trees that aren't surrounded by anything, they will actually shoot up faster Because they're not under the cloud of the other trees that were already there. And what happens is they grow up faster, almost prematurely. So they look magnificent, but they're the first ones to come down when the storm hits. They have not grown under the shade and the branches and the leaves of the greater trees around them. It's a slower growth, but when they finally hit their peak, they're as strong as those who are surrounding them.

Rhett: 1:03:59

Isn't it amazing, how God in nature put very spiritual principles.

Justin: 1:04:03

He's been telling us he wants our own life.

Rhett: 1:04:05

He's been telling us that's why those trees and those forests are so big, so tall, because they are surrounded by other. It's amazing.

Justin: 1:04:11

It really is.

Rhett: 1:04:12

It's beautiful, the covering in the community of others and that protection that's there to let you then ultimately become all that God designed you and desired you to be from the beginning.

Justin: 1:04:24

Yeah, surrounding, yourself with other great people, you plant yourself and you join, being a part of something greater than you could ever be a part of on your own.

Rhett: 1:04:36

Those who are planted in the house of the Lord will flourish, oh man, that's such a good one, you know it's an Old Testament verse, but the principle is basically those who are planted, those who are in a local church, those who are in community with other believers, those who surround themselves with not only God's word and worship and prayer but with other people, that forest of community.

Rhett: 1:04:55

That's on that same path of coming to know God in the way we say it and you can say it a hundred different ways coming to know God in relationship, coming to find freedom from your past so you can see the significance of your future, so that you can begin to go on this discovery of unlocking the purpose that God has for you in your life and that's not one single purpose, that's in so many different areas of your life, to ultimately live that in a way that you're helping other people walk that same journey and making a difference and when you do that and you plant that and you get planted and go through that long period of obscurity and what I love develops hope, develops this ability to help other people.

Rhett: 1:05:35

Like not just be aware, but to be God aware and to be in that stage three that you mentioned earlier. I'm grateful that my good father has allowed certain things to happen, although they were certainly painful and I didn't like it at the time and it wasn't necessarily discipline, but they were moments that if I could see him in and through it, I could learn to see him move in and through even the difficult situations of my life, to see his goodness in ways I would have never seen if I was always comfortable. The goodness of God is in the dirt. The goodness of God is in the darkness sometimes.

Rhett: 1:06:09

The goodness of God, like light shines best in the darkness. Yeah, it's so good and you have to like. I'm grateful for the desert places that I've walked. I'm grateful for the places where I've walked through that I didn't necessarily see or sense the fact that this was God's best for me, but I'm grateful that I went through it because it was really God's best. I would not be the man of God I am today had I not developed the character and the nature and the integrity and the perseverance and the ability to trust him. When the situation didn't look like I should trust him.

Justin: 1:06:42

But because I did choose to trust in those moments man, I began to see the goodness of God in areas that I would have never known otherwise had I not walked through those deep, deep valleys and desert, and that's why someone could say something to you like hey, let me just snap my finger and let you get a do over.

Justin: 1:07:00

I would not do anything over because of the goodness of God that I've seen in my life To get to that moment is rewrap up, when you get the anxiety, the antsiness about what you're in and you feel the uneasiness of where you might be planted and you feel like everything over there is going great and over here. And over there there was a psalm that I was reading last night and I'll try my best to remember this, but I believe it's Psalm 116, verse seven, and it says rest once more, oh my soul, for the Lord has been good to you. And if we can remember that God is always good, god is always he is good, he's nothing but good, he can't be anything else. He is good and no matter what condition we are in right now, or the discomfort or the lack of contentment we may have, if we can slow our spirits down and say rest once more, that means you've had to do it before, you've got to remind yourself rest once more, oh my soul, for the Lord has been good to you, and that's what it's required.

Justin: 1:08:19

These great men that we've talked about the Mark Carells They've had to have those reminders. The Randy Williams, the Chris Hodges they've had to have these reminders before, where they probably got antsy and they wanted to uproot and maybe move or shift or do whatever it is.

Rhett: 1:08:39

They too had to remind themselves Psalm 116, verse 7, be at rest once more, o my soul, for the Lord has been good to you, so until then, we hope you have a great day, stay safe and we will see you soon. Right here with your friends Red and Justin at Armchair Authentic.